Dot wrote: > > Tiny Human Ferret wrote: > > > > Dot wrote: > > > > > > Tiny Human Ferret wrote: > > > > > > > > Dot wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Tiny Human Ferret wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dot wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ea_th wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Dot" <dotdotdotcom@earthlink.net> wrote in message > > > > > > > > news:3AB76516.EB61CB2D@earthlink.net... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's their money, they earn it, who are you to tell them how to spend > > > > > > > > > it? > > > > > > > > > Fascist! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cool. So we take all their welfare benefits away (it's MY money--don't tell > > > > > > > > me how to spend it) and make them pay full taxes and whatever is left over > > > > > > > > is theirs to spend as they so choose--as long as they are here legally. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nice going, bozo! If you had a brain, and/or read the article, you > > > > > > > would have known that the money they are sending home comes from their > > > > > > > wages. They are not on welfare. > > > > > > > > > > > > No, they're not? What do you think is should be called when they go to work > > > > > > for unscrupulous employers who operate unsafe businesses and have no > > > > > > insurance, and they get seriously injured, toxified, or sick, and there's > > > > > > nobody to pay for it except the public taxpayer, because they can't afford a > > > > > > regular doctor and there's noplace else to go but the emergency room or the > > > > > > public clinic? > > > > > > > > > > Emergency rooms are now considered welfare??? > > > > > > > > Yes. It is illegal in the US to turn anyone away from the Emergency Room > > > > simply because they cannot pay. > > > > > > And just how does that make them welfare agencies??? > > > > "Welfare". Look it up. "Public health" and "public welfare" are about the > > same thing, you know. In fact, they're generally-speaking synonymous. > > Just love watching your tongue twist as you stumble over your lies. > About the same, and generally speaking, huh :) > > You aren't even close. > > > > > You really _are_ from another country aren't you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alert America, for it's the busiest room in the hospital. > > > > > > > > We all know how much out taxes are going up because of blatant abuses of the > > > > Emergency Room. It's one of the biggest concerns about illegal alien > > > > colonization. > > > > > > We all know??? I don't know. Perhaps you could provide some cites to > > > support your premises. > > > > No support needed. "Ask any hospital". > > No answer is an answer :) > > > > > > Or perhaps not. Probably not. Let's just say > > > not, because you have no premise, do you. Just an abiding hate for all > > > Mexicans. > > > > Liar. > > UseNut. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The taxpayer pays! It's Welfare! > > > > > > > > > > That could only be said of publicly funded hospitals. What about all of > > > > > the private and not for profit hospitals??? Still welfare? > > > > > > > > Yes. Either that, or they have to shift costs to those who can pay, in which > > > > case everyone's insurance rates go up. Either way, the public pays. > > > > > > But your disability claim, for which you milked the system for far more > > > than you ever paid into the system, is not to be considered welfare???? > > > > What makes you think I "milked" my disability claim? Or that I took more out > > than I paid in? > > You have never done an honest days work in your life, bum. > > > > > > Where do you think that money comes from? Not only are you a welfare > > > > But I'm not. Prove that I am! You can't! Nit Wit! > > You have admitted it in the past. > > > > > > cheat, you are a fool as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >And they're not even citizens, and haven't paid into public-assistance funds! > > > > > > > > > > Err, what are 'public assistance funds'??? Is that a tax that you'al > > > > > have in DC?? > > > > > > > > Social Security, > > > > > > They don't qualify for SS unless they pay into the fund from their > > > earnings, and no SS money is used to support non SS issues. > > > > Sure they do, "Supplimental Security Income". > > Wrong, again. SSI is administered by the Social Security > Administration, but the funds do not come from social security > withholding taxes. > > > > > > > > > > Medicare/Medicaid, > > > > > > They don't qualify for Medicare unless they pay into the fund from their > > > earnings, and no Medicare money is used to support non Medicare issues. > > > > Medicaid is increasingly used as a sort of "slush fund" by most States to > > cover irrecoverable costs; it's one of the reasons it's at risk of going > > broke. > > Medicaid is a state run program, and there is no discussion or even > indication that it is going broke in any of the states that have it. > You mean Medicare, so you are wrong again. > > > And a lot of those irrecoverables are from such things as pregnant > > women crossing the border to give birth in the US to an anchor baby. Do you > > know how much each childbirth costs the State in which it occurs? Nearly > > $100,000, all billed to Medicaid. Every ten illegal immigrants' American > > babies cost the taxpayers a cool million dollars. > > A little more of your scurrilous lies, huh Weasel! > The cost of having a baby: > > http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/980330/30chil.htm > For an uneventful normal pregnancy, 12 prenatal care visits are > usually recommended the cost of which varies according > to > one's insurance plan. According to HCIA Inc., a > Baltimore > health care information company, the cost to insured > patients of > a normal delivery in a hospital averages about $2,800. > (Twins > are cheaper on a per-head basis: typical total delivery > cost: > $4,115.) > > For parents without insurance, direct costs are clearly > much > higher. According to a 1994 study, the cost of an > uncomplicated "normal" delivery averages $6,400 > nationally. > Caesarean delivery costs an average of $11,000, and more > complicated births may range up to $400,000. Premature > babies requiring neonatal intensive care will cost > $1,000 to > $2,500 for every day they stay in the hospital (story, > Page 60). > Though most people can count on insurance to cover a > majority of such costs, there are many people who can't. > According to a report issued in March by the U.S. > government's > Agency for Health Care Policy and Research, 17 percent > of > Hispanic children, 12.6 percent of black children, and 6 > percent > of white ones lack any health insurance coverage > whatsoever, > including coverage by Medicaid or other public programs. > > Do you see any $100,000 claims in there Weasel??? > Didn't think so, but nice try. > Amazing how your lies are rebutted with a simple gooogle search. > > > > > > > > > > general taxes, > > > > > > Oh, like sales tax??? They pay into that little coffer, and > > > disproportionately so. > > > > You're preposterous. _Nobody_ pays into saleds tax disproportionately, > > imbecile! Everyone pays the same flat rate on all purchases! Nit Wit! > > Everyone pays the same flat rate, but the cost of goods varies > tremendously, and the poor usually end up paying more for the same > items, so they end up paying more taxes on those items. It's really > simple, and you would know this stuff if you were in the habit of > actually paying for the stuff you get from the corner convince store > instead of just grabbing and running. > > > > > > > > > > specific withholdings, > > > > > > Running out of straw men??? > > > Give up yet??? > > > > To the likes of you? Never. > > Proving what a fool you are :) > > > > > > > > > > etc which may vary from State to State. > > > > > > > > > It has been established for a long, long time now in these little racist > > > > > > > > These accusations you make of my "racism" are yours and yours alone, Spot. > > > > > > You wish :) > > > Bigot! > > > > > > > Fool. Nobody has ever believed you, they don't believe you now. > > Which is why you squirm so much, huh Weasel :) > > > > > > > > > > > > diatribes of yours, that illegals pay a significant amount of taxes into > > > > > the system via sales tax, the proportion of rent that their landlords > > > > > allocate to property tax, etc., etc. Even those who work 'under the > > > > > table' pay the same taxes that we all do > > > > > > > > Don't be absurd, working "under the table" means they pay no taxes. > > > > > > Means they pay no withholding taxes, no SS or Medicare taxes, no State > > > income taxes. > > > But they do pay all the rest of the taxes, sales, etc. > > > > Sales taxes don't amount to anything compared to the rest of the taxes. > > Sales taxes amount to the majority of the funds that local and state > governments get their operating budgets from. They represent > substantially more money than income taxes do. > > > > > Well, it might if these people didn't live 20 to a one-bedroom apartment. > > If they received a fair wage, they could afford to live in better > housing. > But, as a resident of the ParkBenchHotel, you should be the last one to > criticize. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (except for guys like you who > > > > > defraud the gov'ment with phony disability cases) > > > > > > > > That's egregiously and actionably false. > > > > > > Sue me :) > > > > Oh, if I can ever find you, believe me you will be getting served your > > comeuppance in proper style. > > I'm right here :) > > > > > > I might end up getting a reward for turning in a welfare cheat :) > > > > When and where, motherfucker. > > Post your name and address again and I'll submit it :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > except for state and > > > > > federal withholding taxes (unless you happen to live in a city where > > > > > they tack on an employment tax too). So your bullshit fails, again. > > > > > > > > Sorry, the problem here is that those taxes are by far the majority of all > > > > taxation on the individual. > > > > > > And go into specific accounts designated for specific expenses, all of > > > which are tightly controlled and whose benefits are limited to those who > > > pay into them. > > > > Theoretically, but as we all know, one of the main reasons for the constant > > calls for Welfare, Medicare, Medicaid, and Social-Security reforms is that > > those funds have been dipped into, constantly, whenever some other program > > needs the money. > > Which has nothing at all to do with your ploy suggesting that illegal > aliens are the beneficiaries of it. > > > > > > Illegal aliens who contribute to SS are entitled to > > > receive their benefits when they become eligible. In fact, many SS > > > checks are mailed to Mexico and other Central and South American > > > residents for their entitlements from past employment in the US. That > > > must make you just green with envy :) > > > > Ah, transnational social security fraud! Well holy shit! Thanks for the > > details, we must put a stop to this right away! > > Idiot! When you pay into the system, you reap the benefits. They did, > and do; you didn't and so you lied and cheated and stole yours. > > > > > > > > > > And these individuals pay none of it, plus they > > > > drive up everyone's health insurance costs. > > > > > > How do they drive up health insurance costs when you say their bills are > > > paid by the tax payers??? You really have to get your rant straight. > > > You look so stupid when you say this kind of stuff. > > > > You look even more stupid when you clearly are incapable of understanding > > it. > > > > It's only at the publicly funded clinics where the bills are paid by the > > taxpayers. It's at the private hospitals where the indigents' failure to pay > > bills is cost-shifted to the other patients and onto their insurers (who > > spread it around to all of us). > > The only services private hospitals render to non insured patients are > emergency services. And we are not talking about Emergency Room > services, we are talking about emergency medical conditions. As soon as > a patient is stabilized, they are transferred to a county hospital. And > many private hospitals who render such services are paid for at least a > portion of them by the state or county. > > > > > > > > > > People are tired of runaway > > > > healthcare costs, and it's becoming increasingly evident what proportion of > > > > that is due to abuse of emergency rooms by indigents. > > > > > > Would you like to share those figures with us? Or are you just going to > > > continue with unsubstantiated innuendo, like you usually do? > > > > I expect you'll see it in the Washington Post within a few weeks. > > I'll take that as a 'No", which leaves you with a '0' for 'all' score on > this tryst. > How can one person be so wrong on so many issues and still post???? Possibly because I am not wrong? Dolt! Nit wit! A Magnet for Illegal Immigrants Surge in Undocumented Population Swamps Area Service Providers By Mary Beth Sheridan and Peter Whoriskey Washington Post Staff Writers Tuesday, March 27, 2001; Page A01 They are hiding in plain view. At the parking lot off Route 50 in Fairfax County's Culmore neighborhood, where scores of jeans-clad men cluster seeking day jobs. At the Latino center in Takoma Park, jammed by Salvadoran immigrants signing up for a new legal work program. In the capital's restaurant kitchens, construction sites, day-care centers. New census data suggest that there are far more undocumented immigrants in the United States than previously thought, experts say. But if this phantom workforce has been invisible to policymakers, it hasn't been to many community workers in the Washington area. Those who teach, counsel and heal low-income immigrants say they are struggling to help a group that has swelled beyond official estimates. "We can't provide all the services to the people. Every day, more and more people come," said Gustavo Torres, director of Casa de Maryland, a nonprofit agency in Takoma Park that helps Latino immigrants. No one knows how many undocumented workers are in the Washington area. A hidden population by definition is extremely difficult to count. Schools and social-service agencies rarely ask for evidence of legal residence. But experts agree that the region, with its thriving service economy and surging communities of legal immigrants, has become a magnet for undocumented workers in a way that it wasn't decades ago. Even crude estimates reflect the region's transformation. Virginia, Maryland and the District rank in the top 20 in undocumented immigrants, according to 1996 estimates of the 50 states, plus the District, by the Immigration and Naturalization Service. Virginia is ninth, with 55,000; Maryland is 12th, with 44,000; and the District ranks 18th with 30,000, the INS estimated. Rosario Gutierrez, head of the D.C. mayor's office on Latino affairs, said the city government is pouring millions of dollars into health and education programs aimed at Latino immigrant families. But she doesn't know how many are illegal. "Undocumented people aren't going to say they're undocumented. They send their kids to school, and no one will know," because it is illegal to ask a student's immigration status, she said. But she said the city's Latino population is probably much larger than the latest Census estimate, from August, of about 38,500. In fact, she said, community agencies working with immigrants estimate that there are 80,000 Latinos in the District, including legal and illegal immigrants and the native born. The Census Bureau will release its racial and ethnic population totals for the District this week. The theory that there are more undocumented immigrants than previously estimated has emerged from the 2000 Census, which counted millions more U.S. residents than the Census Bureau had forecast it would. Census officials believe they underestimated the immigrant population by up to 3 million people, many of them undocumented. They hope to have a more conclusive answer by fall. The factors driving people to emigrate may be as simple as that expressed by Alex, one of the young workers who gather each morning in several informally designated parking lots throughout Northern Virginia, waiting to be picked up for day landscaping or construction jobs. "There's no money in Guatemala," said Alex, who declined to give his last name. He interrupted the interview to jump into a truck with an employer who had just materialized. Economic decline or warfare at home are among the key "push" factors driving immigrants to the Washington area. But there are also important "pull" factors: the region's dynamic economy, which has created thousands of entry-level service jobs, and the growing communities of foreign-born legal residents. "We have a critical mass of Latinos here" legally, said Carlos Manjarrez, a research associate at the Urban Institute who has studied the local Latino community. "That makes this a site for people [in other countries] to come to, to rejoin their families, to find the same kind of work their brother found a few years earlier." According to INS estimates, the majority of undocumented people are Latinos. But experts caution that illegal workers in the Washington area aren't all peasants who sneaked across the Rio Grande. Nationally, the INS estimates that 40 percent of illegal residents are "overstayers," who arrived with tourist or student visas, often at entry points like Reagan National Airport, then remained. The Washington area is a magnet for such people, who are often more educated and better off financially than those who came without visas, experts say. The "overstayers" may have skills needed by the large white-collar economy as well as contacts in the city's diplomatic and international organizations. "We're not talking about Guatemalans who are busboys and doing household domestic chores. These are people who have college and high school degrees and computer proficiency. They fit more easily into a high-tech service environment," said Robert D. Manning, a sociologist at the University of Houston Law School who has studied the immigrant community here. Such immigrants may be middle-class Argentines working in malls, Irish running pubs or Indians working in firms that serve the high-tech industry. They are often less visible than poorer immigrants who may cluster in ethnic neighborhoods. Immigrant activists have recently gotten a vivid glimpse of the pool of undocumented workers in the area. On March 2, after two devastating earthquakes in El Salvador, President Bush agreed to grant 18-month work permits to Salvadorans who are in the country illegally. Since then, nonprofit Latino groups have been inundated by Salvadorans seeking to fill out the paperwork for the program, known as temporary protected status. "In the past month, these people have been coming in alarming quantities to community organizations to legalize," said Torres, of the Casa de Maryland. His agency, which helps about 15 Salvadorans a day through the process, is so swamped that applicants must wait until May for an appointment. Torres said his agency also is struggling to help a growing number of immigrants -- some of them illegal -- with English classes, legal services and employment training. Jorge Figueredo, executive director of the nonprofit Hispanic Committee of Virginia, said he couldn't estimate the size of the area's undocumented population. But he said the upswing in Latino immigration overall has overburdened agencies seeking to help people with affordable housing and transportation. "Is this population being served? No. And the reason is that the numbers of immigrants has been growing so fast," he said. Some believe the 2000 Census has picked up many more people in part because of greater efforts to count illegal immigrants. Maria Gomez, who runs Mary's Center for Maternal and Child Care, a nonprofit agency in the District's Adams-Morgan neighborhood that aids Latinos, believes many people simply were missed in earlier counts. "There was no outreach in the community," she said. That changed with last year's census. The bureau hired people trusted by immigrant communities, such as workers at local clinics. Census workers gave lectures to English as a Second Language classes. They homed in on neighborhoods where immigrants lived. They approached people as often as possible in their own language. And yet, the counters still missed some undocumented residents. Among those who believe they weren't counted is Eric, a 19-year-old construction worker from Guatemala who did not give his last name. He was living in a Falls Church apartment with his brother and five friends when the census form arrived. None of the seven men were counted, he said, because they threw the form away. "My friends were afraid that it would cause trouble with immigration," Eric said. "When the census people called, we said it was in the mail." -- Be kind to your neighbors, even | "Global domination, of course!" though they be transgenic chimerae. | -- The Brain "People that are really very weird can get into sensitive positions and have a tremendous impact on history." -- Dan Quayle